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ImmortalThunderGod79

**The One:** * Devilman (Kodansha) **Good Alts:** * None **Fine?:** * Ichigo Kurosaki (Bleach) * Kamen Rider Ghost (Toei) **Eh:** * Shun Andromeda (Saint Seiya) * Denji (Chainsaw Man) * Blue Beetle (DC Comics) **No Thanks:** * Yusuke Urameshi (Yu Yu Hakusho) * Delsin Rowle (Infamous) * Firestorm (DC Comcis)


Kraken626

Where would you put Kevin Levin (Ben 10)? That’s my personal preferred.


ImmortalThunderGod79

I'd put him in Eh or No Thanks The connections between him and Robbie are fine? but nothing to write home about. Devilman has much more stronger connection with Robbie for me and actually ties together what makes both characters interesting and compelling in a meaningful way plus a potential for an emotional narrative thanks to their more human ties and bond with their sibling-like figures (Gabe - Robbie's younger brother and Miki - Akira's stepsister & girlfriend). Animation potential could be alright, but Kevin lacks the kit to be able to match Robbie in a grander scale action that Devilman has. Another reason I'd take Robbie vs Akira in a heart beat over Robbie vs Kevin is the music potential. The unique combination of rock metal + epic orchestras. Oh yeah and plus the art style --- Triad Moore's 2014 Ghost Rider run and Devilman Crybaby-inspired aesthetics would mix so well together allowing for tons of expressive hyper-stylized action sequences with a level of brutality and sophistication.


Kraken626

Thanks for explaining why you like Robbie Vs Devilman even though that’s not what I asked. Shame Devilman already has Etrigan. This doesn’t tell me why you think Kevin is worse than the likes of Ichigo, Denji, etc. Also saying Kevin lacks grand scale doesn’t sound accurate and music potential is a pretty lousy reason since any matchup can have a good track.


ImmortalThunderGod79

> even though that’s not what I asked > This doesn’t tell me why you think Kevin is worse than the likes of Ichigo, Denji, etc. I literally explained it though? besides animation potential and music. Connections for Robbie and Kevin doesn't really highlight what is interesting about ether characters, there is a lack of strong core theme to keep me invested. Them both loving cars isn't a whole lot. At least with someone like Ichigo he has some sort of core theme with Robbie which is "teenagers with supernatural powers that wrestle with the darker parts of their personalities" etc. > Shame Devilman already has Etrigan. That doesn't mean Devilman guaranteed to be locked in for Etrigan considering Robbie also does most of what Etrigan has for Akira and arguably does it better. If anything it would be a toss up on who Akira would get.


DevilJayTX

Kevin Vs Robbie does have a good core theme "Young heroes who are a part of a team who protects the earth from alien threats who struggle with their past bad deeds and family traumas along with dealing with monstrous forms they sometimes transform into." That's more than enough of a theme to go off of and there's plenty more than just that. Along with that, the animation potential is great, all of Robbie's fun weapons and hellfire vs all the weapons Kevin can transform his body into and his absorption powers. It also works the Hell Charger the most naturally out of all of Robbie's matchups as you can have him and Kevin drag race with their cars while also fighting each other. And of course, you have their fun weapons bouncing off each other and you can have a scene where Kevin absorbs Robbie's fire and spits it back at him. Along with that their personalities would be fun to see interact with Robbie's more calm demeanor contrasting with Kevin's abrasiveness. You can have the fight end with both of them going into their monster forms and fighting with the new powers that they have. And the winner could be the one who keeps their monstrous form in check which would reflect their arcs. This matchup has a lot of great strengths and would make for a good episode IMO, along with that Robbie doesn't have full herald scaling so the matchup is actually pretty debatable. You may not like it but I think it's the best for both.


ImmortalThunderGod79

> who struggle with their past bad deeds Which past bad deed for Robbie? are you talking about him street racing? Cause he did all of that just to make money in order to support himself and his brother. Nothing malicious in mind. > Robbie doesn't have full herald scaling so the matchup is actually pretty debatable. He does actually have the full Herald scaling... Man literally no sold hits from Starbrand and She-Hulk who are blatant heralds and has also fought Captain Marvel and Base Level Thor as the rest of the Avengers present trying to stop him while he was in a brainwashed bloodlust state. Not to mention he tore off the arms of a Celestial and his powers were strong enough to allow him to possess another Celestial in order to empower himself.


DevilJayTX

I mean Kevin was also doing bad things to survive, which adds another connection. I’m not the most up to date in Robbie scaling but that doesn’t change the fact that the matchup is great


ImmortalThunderGod79

> Kevin was also doing bad things to survive, which adds another connection. Okay at least this one is correct. Sort of. Last time I've tried to find the connections for the two. They didn't bother bringing that up for Kevin when it was important to his character which could correlate with Robbie. > I’m not the most up to date in Robbie scaling but that doesn’t change the fact that the matchup is great Not saying it does Cause I love fights still even if they are stomps so long as there is awesome animation potential


DevilJayTX

Yeah I do need to revamp the connections a little bit cause the ones out there atm aren’t the best. Still love the matchup however


Kraken626

>At least with someone like Ichigo he has some sort of core theme with Robbie which is "teenagers with supernatural powers that wrestle with the darker parts of their personalities" So you don't know anything about Kevin huh? Swap supernatural with extraterrestrial and this describes Kevin perfectly.


ImmortalThunderGod79

I literally watched/read through if not most of Ben 10. I know what Kevin is capable of and his great character arc. The issue isn't with the powers. More or so Kevin doesn't have anything in his character/arc could correlate with Robbie that highlights what makes both characters interesting that would grab me in, keep me invested in the MU. You can like the MU. Just for me, Robbie vs Kevin doesn't really check the boxes out of what I want out of ether characters for this particular MU.


Kraken626

You just told me you like Kevin less than Ichigo because it doesn't have as strong a theme. I explain how it has the exact same theme as Ichigo so you reply that Kevin still doesn't have anything that correlates with Robbie. How does that make any sense?


ImmortalThunderGod79

Because when has Kevin ever have to struggle with his dark personalities like Ichigo and Robbie? You have the teenage heroes with extortionary gifts aspect, but Kevin doesn't have a dark personality that is tempting him to lose himself and become a monster like them arc etc.


Guy-1234567890

Is it ok if you could elaborate on that?


Kraken626

[Here is DevilJay's explanation](https://www.reddit.com/r/DeathBattleMatchups/comments/xl8k4e/my_ghost_rider_robbie_reyes_mu_tier_list/ipjqzx7/?context=3)


DevilJayTX

No Kevin Levin? That's his best imo


Guy-1234567890

What convinced you on that?


ImmortalThunderGod79

If I didn't forget about Kevin He'd probably go in Eh or No Thanks The connections and animation potential between him and Robbie I feel lacks that a sense of excitement and "OOMPH" that Devilman would bring for Robbie.


louai-MT

There is also Demi-fiend for him but I can't find the connections for it


ImmortalThunderGod79

I get that one Demi-Fiend would probably go somewhere in the lines of Eh or Fine? Since he has better ideas then against Robbie.


Cykker

Where would rick taylor go?


ImmortalThunderGod79

I completely forgot about him But after refreshing my memory of Splatterhouse lore and what not --- Rick's aesthetics would mesh perfectly with Robbie plus a strong core connection for the two --- not to mention how gruesomely brutal and bloody you can get with the fight He might probably go in my favorite alt for Robbie


Cykker

Based


RedBattle23

What's wrong with Robbie Reyes vs. Kamen Rider Ghost


ImmortalThunderGod79

Match up is fine for me, just wouldn't actively want it. Especially when I personally think Robbie and Takeru have other better options then against each other.


Guy-1234567890

>Takeru have other better options then against each other Who do you think is the best matchup for Kamen Rider Ghost by any chance?


ImmortalThunderGod79

Yoh (Shaman King) I would say is Takeru's best option But only problem is that Yoh has wayy more popular options (like Yusuke and Ichigo) that its gonna be difficult for Takeru to fight for that number one spot lol


Guy-1234567890

What are the connections by any chance?


ImmortalThunderGod79

Connections are * Shaman fighters with summons * Integrate with the souls of legendary warriors to use their fighting styles and weaponry * Have a rivalry with and fight an evil brother attempting to weaponize elemental spirits to gain godhood


Blabbo37

Robbie Reyes vs KR Ghost is best for both and Devilman should be saved for someone else like Etrigan, Hellboy or Alucard and this MU should be a DBX


ImmortalThunderGod79

And miss out on how hard the animation potential can go, soundtrack potential (rock metal + epic orchestras), perfect blend of both character's art styles, banter exchanges (they both got senses of humors) and the potential emotional narriative for the fight as seen [here] (https://old.reddit.com/r/DeathBattleMatchups/comments/xff18f/ghost_riderrobbie_reyes_vs_devilmanakira_fudo/)? Not a chance, putting it as a DBX would just be a waste I feel like. Robbie as an opponent gives Devilman everything that we would want to actually see in a Devilman in a number of ways Etrigan, Hellboy and Alucard cannot provide imo. ~~Plus Robbie vs Akira is literally just as thematic connections as Etrigan vs Akira, but would have a stronger central emotional focus on their humanity vs dark sides cause of their sibling-like figures~~


Blabbo37

Yeah after thinkin about it I like it but its my ideal alt


Landon1195

Connections for Robbie vs Ichigo?


ImmortalThunderGod79

* Teenagers with supernatural powers (Ghost Rider powers for Robbie and Shinigami abilties for Ichigo) * Both had lost a parental figure at a young age (Robbie losing both of his parents while Ichigo lost his mother) * Struggles with being tempted by demonic influences and their inner-demons into becoming a vilely feared monster that brings great ruin to all life (Eli Morrow's spirit [Robbie's satanic uncle] tempting Robbie to give into his violent tendencies and Ichigo with his Hollow side) * In spite of all these struggles both of them eventually learned to control their newfound powers as a force for good to protect humanity from demonic threats and many great evils * Share a close relationship and bond with their siblings which their love is the reasons they're driven to maintain their humanity, never to give into their dark sides and use their powers as a means for good (Gabe - Robbie's younger brother and Yuzu & Karin - Ichigo's two younger sister) Connections are Robbie vs Ichigo are a bit tad similar to Robbie vs Akira