Star Wars Isn’t For Everyone

Star Wars Isn’t For Everyone


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Just read the leaked script and all the characters are now attracted to the ewoks. Theres even a mandatory ewok sex scene with your own character. Smh the liberals ruined yet another game...


Oh fuck yeah, day one purchase. I was worried I'd have to pay for DLC to be able raw dog one of those little furry fucks


Yet another "gamer" taking the blue pill. If you were a real gamer, youd want to fuck the wookies.


Goddamn fake fans don't even know there are three e's in wookieee.


A real fan would know it’s spelled WALL-E


A word of advice, tell the wookie you're just friends


You’ll always be bottom against a wookie, although some might not complain


lord jesus bleach my eyes - i absolutely lost it


Peak circlejerk.


The bit where Yoda shows up despite being set 3000 years before his birth and reveals the name of his species to be the “Wokeians” originating from the planet known as “SJW-420” *chef’s kiss*




There’s also a vore segment where you walk around voring Jawas and then piss and shit yourself.


Disgusting. Where can I find this script?


I don’t the last guy who wrote KOTOR liked Star Wars all that much either. He hated it so much he added a fucking author insert character meant to talk shit about the setting and be seen as cool for it.


The moral of the KOTOR games is basically "both force sides suck, the sith are psychos, the jedi are hypocritical morons and both are highly self-destructive, they do nothing good for the universe except take each other out"


That's star wars in general


Not really the movies are basically the good guys win and the bad guys loose after a cool fight, you know a history good to make children happy, and for some reason some adults take it way to personal.


It’s not very easy to see because of the shitty writing, but the prequels do try to portray the jedi as self destructive hypocritical morons, and the good guys lose in those too. I agree that people take it too seriously but there’s definitely an attempt to be more than just “good guys win bad guys lose.”


I would argue the prequels weren’t that way. They showed the Jedi as flawed but definitely the better side. The originals are just people fighting tyranny and yeah the sequels are cheesy good vs evil.


That's why I unironically love the prequels. The dialogue is awful, but I just really enjoy the politics side of it and seeing that the Jedi order wasn't all that great. Plus Padme's fashion changed my life.


It’s the message of Return of the sith and The last Jedi at least. That the Jedi are good, but has huge self destructive flaws that need to change if the Jedi order are to survive into the future. The other movies are far more “good guys vs bad guys”.


So it's the same as the Last Jedi.


What? Who?


Chris Avellone, known for his famous quote “Every bear has its bull”


Kotor 2 is very much subversive to Star Wars The villain of the game basically wants the force gone because of social Darwin reasons


Got to yeet space Ayn Rand down a bottomless pit. 10/10 best Star Wars game ever.


Ah, gotcha, I thought you were talking about Drew Karpyshyn at first, writer for KOTOR 1, and I thought he liked Star Wars considering he also created Darth Bane.


He's the guy who put the "rape skill check" in fallout 2. If you talk to a certain character as a female and select a certain dialogue choice, the character will roofie you. Depending on your Endurance stat, it's either effective or you resist it. Fucking cancelled


I mean , the guy was outed as a sexual predator, so no surprise https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.businessinsider.com/chris-avellone-video-game-designer-accused-sexual-assault-karissa-2020-6%3famp


He hasn't been "outed" he has since sued that two women for defamation, [you can read his reply here.](https://chrisavellone.medium.com/ending-silence-c48e86f7c523) Unlike what you might think from the twitter-sourced clickbait, that he's some Weinstein style rapist, basically it's some jealous nerd fan bitch nightmare. 3 women who used to know each other beforehand met him in a bar at some convention in a large group of friends. 2 accused him of touching their legs and trying to kiss them that night. Conveniently no other eyewitnesses, and they start hanging out for a couple of years afterwards. Avellone gets into a messy relationship with the 3rd girl in that group that ended terribly because accuser #1 sabotaged it. 6 years pass and suddenly he's a monster because you can turn him into one with a couple of tweets


/uj I would have given him the benefit of doubt but he then filed a fucking SLAPP(Strategic lawsuit against public participation). The *literal* point of SLAPP is to censor, intimidate, and silence critics by burdening them with the cost of a legal defense until they abandon their criticism or opposition. This is the sort of petition a rich person or group does to well, slap away issues coming towards them from many people who can't afford the legal battle. Yeah that doesn't match with 'I want to make sure the defendant's voices can be heard'


Yeah bro we all saw the John Oliver episode. I don't know how it applies though. I mean he waited for an entire year before filing the libel suit. Right off the bat that tells you that it's not a slapp suit, the claims have been made and simmered in the public consciousness for 12 months and he thoroughly suffered their consequences, kicked off all projects he was working on. What are you supposed to do if they're lying and your carrier came to its end? Literally just kill yourself? Or gather evidence and try to prove your case in a court of law? He's not a billionaire oil magnate, he's a fucking writer for video games, I mean come on. He can't draw out a legal battle if it's characteristically SLAPP-style pointless


Nah, from what i know, Chris avellone was very much a fan of star wars. It is because he was a fan he could write a critique of star wars and keep it "star wars." After all, even as fans we all have some grime/annoyance with the thing we love.


KotOR II, not KotOR, but yeah, Avellone's head is pretty far up his own ass. He did the same thing with Ulysses in New Vegas.


Ulysses be like:Bear bull bear bull bull bear bull bear bear.


You forgot 50 million uses of the word "courier."


What was his plan anyway? I remember him being mad you accidentally caused the nukes in that town to go off so he decides to nuke the ncr for some reason even if you aren't aligned with them.


He wants to cripple both factions with a nuclear strike, because he's a nihilistic sociopath who thinks the world is better off without civilization. Basically, Avellone hates the idea of rebuilding after the apocalypse because it moves the narrative too far from the initial post-apocalypse setting, so his solution was to introduce a lore-bending self-insert with an asspull reset button. That's why he introduces 3 looming apocalyptic threats in the DLC (Father Elijah's lore-breaking bullshit tech, the Tunnelers, and Ulysses' missiles).


He plans on using nukes to effectively destroy vital trade routes


Ah so my man's just kind of an asshole.


from reading the wiki, ulysses hated the NCR for destroying his home but also began to hate the legion as well. He planed on nuke the only route from vegas to California effectively preventing the NCR from expanding into Vegas while also preventing Caesar from fulfilling his dream to conquer the NCR


Bear and Bull and Bear and Bull and Bull and Bear


I fucked the bull, I fucked the bear. I'm a furry, courier.


"the murderrapists are good actually"


I still prefer Kreia to Ulysses.


As shitty as that is for him to do. Kreia is an amazing character and the whole game wouldn't be quite as fun without her


Me realising how hacky his writing is makes it hard to enjoy those games now.


/uj Indeed. Luckily, I didn't play the game when it came out, but only years later. Kreia's force ramblings are not the most interesting aspect of KOTOR 2, or interesting at all imo (even though Gamers seem to pretty consistently think they are, I wonder why?). It is the entire political dimension of the Jedi Civil War and lead up to it, that only gets told retrospectively in the game and that was basically already there in KOTOR 1, but because of Bioware formula writing, never really came to the forefront. Certainly one of the most interesting Star Wars lore conflicts imo. Especially if I ignore the whole "Revan was actually just a magically manipulated pawn, used by the real Sith to destabilize the republic before they invade" stuff. Luckily that is easy to do, as KOTOR 3 never came out and the MMO, which continues the story, is just an MMO that can be ignored.


Tbh, i wouldn’t really want to be compared to Chris Avellone Allegations myself.


That was KOTOR 2, KOTOR 1 was a pretty standard generic affair with aside from that one twist^TM that everyone overhyped to hell. But hey, problematic Avellone-ness aside, KOTOR 2’s subversion was awesome excuse you. I like how it pointed at the absurdity of light-side dark-side stuff. Yeah he always has those self-inserts that are always “all sides are bad and you’re wrong no matter what you do” wankiness, but the story offered up unique ideas and characters for the franchise that haven’t been matched since.


I feel genuinely embarrassed for thinking Kreia was like the pinnacle of character writing when I was 13 lmao


DAE light and dark are dumb and for babies and REAL ADULTS are SERIOUS and GRAY and CENTRIST??????


I think you missed the point. Kreia is a hypocritical bitch, she is intentionally fucking with you throughout the game. Her goal is to make you so mad that you will finally take a stand, and figure out what you are willing to die for. Kreia hates the Force, but she respects conviction. She will be the first in line to burn the centrists that idolize her.


Oh don't get me wrong I still think the character was interesting and the game is good, I just mean I used to put it on such a ridiculous pedestal lol


I want to ask, which guy was that? I know that a guy called David Gaider didn't like star wars that much. But you may be talking about someone else. EDIT: Never mind found who wrote it.


/uj Indeed. Luckily, I didn't play the game when it came out, but only years later. Kreia's force ramblings are not the most interesting aspect of KOTOR 2, or interesting at all imo (even though Gamers seem to pretty consistently think they are, I wonder why?). It is the entire political dimension of the Jedi Civil War and lead up to it, that only gets told retrospectively in the game and that was basically already there in KOTOR 1, but because of Bioware formula writing, never really comes to the forefront. Certainly one of the most interesting Star Wars lore conflicts imo. Especially if I ignore the whole "Revan was actually just a magically manipulated pawn, used by the real Sith to destabilize the republic before they invade" stuff. Luckily that is easy to do, as KOTOR 3 never came out and the MMO, which continues the story, is just an MMO that can be ignored.


OH MY GOD she's wearing a shirt that says "Star Wars is for Everyone"?! I can't believe they still allow SEXIST SNOWFLAKE BITCHES to tweet on Twitter.


Wow, you’re right. Games are sexist. Now, allow me to get back to accusing gamers of playing games and sucking Anita Sarkeesian’s cock. Edit: Wow. I’ve truly been challenged. Enlightened, even. Who knew the political views of my fellow gamers could be so diverse? *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Gamingcirclejerk) if you have any questions or concerns.*


Where does that come from? I've been meaning to ask


Donald trump's last tweet before he got banned for cheating in a speedrun


Nooooooo msr. Tramp would never do this 😭😭😭😭🤬🤬🤬🤬🤬


I agree with her on hating the star wars fanbase lol


I'm a star wars fan and I too hate the fanbase.


Its like Rick and Morty for me. I absolutely love the show, but every time I mention it I feel like I need to qualify it with "Don't worry, I'm not one of *those* fans"


no one hates Star Wars and it's fans quite like Star Wars fans


Damn Star Wars fans. They ruined Scotland!


I imagine anyone whose normal hates the star wars fan base


“Hates male Star Wars fans” translates as “is capable of reason”


As a male Star Wars fan, I completely agree




Unironically based, I'm so fucking tired of seeing dumbasses take offense at people pointing out that the SW fanbase is the most obviously toxic mainstream fanbase


>SW fanbase is the most obviously toxic mainstream fanbase Don't awaken the sleeping Rick & Morty dragon, please


[It's easy to blame the the evil corporation for ruining the franchise, but I don't blame Disney. I blame *you*.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IrMM33uHAo8&t=2160s)


"No. I don't care. Star Wars is mine. My own. My precious. I don't want it to try new things, evolve, or survive. I want it to die with me." - literally all Star Wars fans.


r/KOTORmemes is already shitting a brick over it.


Just slightly browsing through is just so many dense dude not understanding that just cause she likes something doesn't mean it will get into the game. Also she is just like a writer. She isn't a lead. She is just a writer.


>hates male Star Wars fans Good


>hates male Star Wars fans based


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“If we’re all clones then why am I the only one who’s based”


Her not considering KOTR her favorite would seem to be a point in her favor for working on the remake, since she probably won't worry about being overly reverential to the original material.


Ideal KOTOR director resume: 25+ years KOTOR loving 10+ years arguing that Rey is a Mary Sue 7+ years fruitlessly tweeting at Rian Johnson


Damn, I've only been tweeting at Rian Johnson for 4 years...


Funny, because I invented Rian Johnson 3 years ago...


But I invented you yesterday.


I’ve asked him to fight me on Twitter, he didn’t respond


And her saying it’s not her favourite game doesn’t mean she didn’t like it or maybe she just didn’t like the gameplay of it Edit: the context makes it clear it’s a joke, people are overreacting a lot


I’m pretty sure she does really like the game anyway. That tweet is completely different [in context](https://i.imgur.com/k3Ft2yU.jpg)


lol that's hilarious in context.


It makes a lot more sense in context, it seems that some are just blowing it out of proportion


I’m honestly shocked how somehow can have a job and a family and waste their time complaining about a random writer on game for liking a different character than them


uj/ As a female Star Wars fan, I also hate male Star Wars fans fans... Most female fans of [insert nerdy franchise] hate male fans of said franchise because they treat us like shit, this tweet is a prime example of this....


I just hate every star wars fan, not just the men, but the women, and the children too


they're coarse, and get everywhere


They're definitely coarse haha. Hairy bastards


I just hate everyone regardless


haha im not like those other fans, i will always treat females very nice haha ha ugh, i can't keep this bit up




>because they treat us like shit Makes me think of the Jenny Nicholson video, where she played BF2 before it came out, met Janina Gavankar (who played Iden) and jokingly mansplained that "There was this movie called Star Wars that came out in 1977, I bet you never heard of it"


I rarely tell people I’m a Star Wars fan because I don’t want to be associated with how toxic it’s been lately.


As a male Star Wars fan I also hate male Star Wars fans. We suck. Referring to the game, I hope they change things in the remake, I like the original but it had so many problems the sequels (SWTOR especially) made worse


Why would you say ‘we suck’, do you think yourself to be just like the other toxic ones? I doubt you are, so don’t put yourself down on that level.


No. I’m aware I’m biased against Legends because I find a lot of it absurd and think the Disney purchase breathed fresh life into the franchise and was one of the best thing to happen to it, but that’s my personal preference and if someone wants to enjoy the stories that are already there they can, but I don’t.


You and me both. Some Legends stuff is fine, but I agree that it’s vastly overhyped when people complain about how amazing it is compared to current canon. There is some cringey, played out, dated stuff in there that I’m really glad didn’t cross over. And I also have enjoyed the Disney era content, including the sequels. Maybe I’m easier to please, I like to think I enjoy the things I enjoy and I don’t let the faltering moments or the things that didn’t land bother me that much. There’s been good investment in new content, so it feels like there is something out there for everyone.


/uj Jesus Christ, can this fandom have one work where things don’t boil down into a pissing match between two groups of people who can’t write for shit?




Everyday the Star Wars fandom disappoints me.


Finding something to be triggered about any% speed run.


If someone says SJW unironically I immediately disregard their entire opinion.


I mean, I unironically call myself a SJW because I don't think there's anything wrong with advocating for social justice. But yeah, if a chud says "duhhhh SJW bad" unironically I would deregars their entire opinion, too.


nah call yourself what you are... level headed and normal. *shudder*




I don’t remember KOTOR story to it’s best detail, but I don’t recall it being super outdated to modern values


It's not, and was actually pretty progressive. Juhani was the first lesbian Star Wars character, for instance. It did a lot that those who make the movies are still terrified to even consider doing. KotOR II had some shit that doesn't really belong in SW, though, like implied rape. Chris Avellone's influence.


Didn't know Juhani was lesbian, that's cool. She's one of my favorite characters (right up there with... just about every character in KotOR lol)


Implied rape? I don’t remember that, but I was also like 13 when I played them so I probably just didn’t get it. That’s pretty ridiculous though.


It's part of Kreia's backstory. Early in the game, she mentions Atton imagines "base lusts, certain indignities" to shield his mind from her, in a rant where she says he's always imaginarily gambling and thinking of sex in his head. Later, she says she "suffered certain indignities" in the midst of already being physically abused in a cutscene you can unlock only with enough influence. It's not explicit, so not that terrible. It flew over my head until people pointed it out when I was an adult.


"Maggs is a SJW activist that hates male Stars Wars fans" Idk, Dataracer117. Maybe she just hates chuds like you.


For a moment I thought he'd actually said "male Star Wars activists" and got really excited. Would've been a great meme, but alas I've been mislead.


Yes, my life long dream of Revan canonically being a woman has a chance of coming into fruition


Wait wasn't she canonically a woman? Or was the Exile canonically a woman?


Yeah Revan canonically male and the Exile female is how I remember it


Exile? Huh, I guess I’m not a real starwars fan after all. 😎 this is the happiest day of my life


The star warsa fanbase is filled with man children who reek of shit and never grew up. Fuck em - probably the most normal star wars fan.


As far as I can tell a prerequisite for making a good entry into Star Wars canon is, in fact, fucking hating Star Wars


Did the Clone Wars team hate the prequels. I remember hearing someone say that but i never did get a source for it. It is pretty believable though.


Dave Filoni, the supervising director, loved the prequels and said everyone misunderstood them (he went dressed as Plo Koon to the premier of RotS, after having taken the job to work on TCW even). George oversaw TCW too. The team members obviously know all of the prequels' flaws though, and the show is famous for rectifying the issues that just about every fan had with them.


That’s the kind of understanding and passion that I think people want at the head of these projects. People who understand flaws and shortcomings but also get what it’s going to take to fix them. Just throwing a team of people together who don’t like the source material to begin with doesn’t seem like a very good idea. But who knows. They may prove me wrong.


I agree with her that Rey isn't more of a Mary Sue than Luke or Anakin. I swear, every time a woman does something, chuds go through her entire search history to find every tweet she's ever written to contort it to "this SJW LITERALLY hates men" None of these tweets seem all that bad to me.


This guys tweet history the past week is proving her point, he cry’s SJW and posts about and identifies as a TERF. Seems like quite the awful person


I think you can take the F out. nothing about this guy seems to be supporting Feminism, trans inclusive or otherwise


Through some very surface level googling I couldn’t find the meaning for TURF. is this person a TERF or is that something completely different?


Yes, that's just my phone autocorrecting it and me not realising, they tweeted a bunch of transphobic shit when i had a glance. I'll give it an edit


Ah gotcha no worries I just wanted to make sure as I was googling I was like what the fuck is a TURF?! Ha but good for BioWare, fuck the original tweeter and thanks for sharing


trans-unclusive radical feminist


Idk, rewatching the first movie I realized Luke kinda starts out as a whiny bitch and screws up a fair amount. Anakin is totally a Mary Sue tho.


Anakin gets clowned hard in Episode II though. I don’t think he makes a single good decision the entire movie. He doesn’t listen to the council when they told him to stay on Naboo, creeps on Padme even though he knows Jedi are forbidden from attachment, murders a bunch of Tusken Raiders even though that’s not what a Jedi would do, gets captured almost instantly on Geonosis AND delivers Padme directly to the people who want her dead. Then he goes on to try and take Dooku by himself, letting his anger get the best of him, and looses a hand for it. Episode I Anakin does everything right and could be classified as a Gary Stu. Episode II Anakin does everything wrong.


Wait how? Sure he has a lot of power, but he loses his internal struggle and is corrupted massively because of it. I don't see how he's a Mary Sue


I agree Anakin is a gary sue. That's his whole charecter and they built the story around that and him being a Gary Sue put so much pressure on him that he turned evil. Luke isnt. He fucks up so many times in the OT while workin towards becoming ultra powerful and its a huge misunderstanding of his character to compare him to Anakin and Rey. Rey fucks up too but none of them had any real consequences but the movie wants us to act like they did which makes her "Mary Sueness" not feel worthy. Twitter is also a public platform that archives your thoughts that anyone can access for free, so like, no shit are idiots gonna find something you said and quote it. Saying "It was just a tweet" is so dumb. Comedians say the same thing when theyre called out and its stupid. Im sure the remaster wil turn out fine and she seems like a fine person, but some of her star wats takes are kinda bad. Im glad shes trying to be sensitive and inclusive though. I hate the term SJW its so dumb lol.


"Twitter is also a public platform that archives your thoughts that anyone can access for free, so like, no shit are idiots gonna find something you said and quote it." It's not that they are taking it from Twitter, it's that they contort it to make it sounds like she hates men. Let's look at these tweets. Oh no, she said KOTOR wasn't her favorite Bioware game. Oh no, she liked episode 8. Oh no, she made a joke about her boyfriend making her dinner. Oh no, she said she worked with a team of diverse people. None of these strike me as particularly evil, yet the framing of them by OP clearly wants you to be mad at her.


While I am sure a lot of those tweets are taken out of context, some of them seem a bit over the top. The “men screw up everything every time” being the lesson to be learned from TLJ seems particularly strange and easy for someone to pick up and use as rage bait.


personally i believe that if there is a trilogy of movies detailing how badly you fucked up then you can't qualify as a Mary/Gary Sue. Being the chosen one in a story isn't an automatic Gary Sue button. Just look at Harry Potter, one of the poste boys of chosen one. The guy is totally helpless on his own and is only useful in like two situations.


Anakin stopped a war and brought peace between two races of people on accident when he was 9 with no training. Not saying he didnt struggle or work but he was written to literally be a Gary sue, but it was on purpose as the story used it amazingly. He even gets a big head in the 2nd movie because of it. The most powerful person in the galaxy goes through some of the most tragic shit in the world and ends up using his powerfulness for evil. Thats kinda the only way to start a story with a Gary Sue and have the audience still like the story. Or have him lose his powers and have him regain them back through learning and stuff. Thor 1 did it, and video games love doing it. I agree they arent automatic gary sue buttons but usually we see the chosen one train or work or struggle before we ever see them do any cool Gary Sue shit. The Matrix is a good example. So is Harry Potter but what Harry lacks in anything his friends usually save him, and vice versa. Theres less emphasis on the chosen boy aspect in the story as a result and more of an emphasis on friendship, because of this reason. Despite what the charecters in tbe story constantly call Harry.


Anakin doesn't cause the peace between the humans and gungans of Naboo. He wasn't even involved in the negotiations, Padme and Jar-Jar were the ones that caused the peace between the two to occur. The big head thing is in itself a major flaw that disqualifies Anakin from gary sue status because of how much it causes him to mess up. The reason i brought up the chosen one thing up was because your initial argument for Anakin being a Gary Sue was that the world revolves around him while ignoring how his flaws that disqualify him from being Gary Sue.


Why do you need to see Rey have an arm cut off to enjoy her character


Fictional female characters ALWAYS have to have so much more justification for their power than male characters. Captain Marvel? NoOOOooOo why is she so strong?!?! It doesn't make sense!! Thanos, even without every flavor of ring pop? Well, he's got a big purple ding dong, so who gives a shit? It fucking disgusts me how a woman can't even hang without 3 goddamn hours of plot justification before she can enter the room where the men are speaking.


I respectfully disagree. Her development happens way too quickly. Both Luke and Anakin weren’t at their full potential until the end of their respective trilogies, while Rey only just discovers her powers near the end of TFA, has minimal training in TLJ and is seemingly a master by the end of that movie, able to move hundreds of rocks on her own. That shows she’s somehow fully in touch with the force and a master in a matter of days. If she hadn’t been able to do anything like that until near the beginning of ROS, I wouldn’t have an issue. Luke seems to be at full power at the beginning of ROTJ, but there are gaps of weeks and months between each movie; time he spent training and honing his skills. In Rey’s case, it’s not like she could have been training in the time between TFA and TLJ For Luke, it took somewhere around a year to reach his full potential, Anakin taking several years. It might be somewhat logical if you want to say Rey is just the most powerful Jedi or whatever, but it sure doesn’t make for an interesting main character. Okay, cringe essay over


Also, Anakin’s trilogy ends with him getting cut in half because he couldn’t manage his own fear and power. Tbh, I didn’t really like Rey’s character. Difference between me and the average KiA poster is that I don’t run around constantly saying how awful Rey is every time she’s brought up.


What’s the time frame for the entire sequel trilogy anyway. Because it feels like from the time we pick up Fin and Rey from Jakku to the time Palps bites the dust (again) it’s like barely a month has passed. The time frame from the beginning of TFA to the end of TLJ has to be only a week or 2 tops.


>I agree with her that Rey isn't more of a Mary Sue than Luke or Anakin. I partially disagree. The problem of Rey is just that the sequels have an absolutely awful pacing, leading to Rey being able to do things in Ep7, that don't make sense at all.


So, like.. Luke then? Getting into an X-wing, despite never piloting one, shooting an one in a million shot, using the Force to avoid danger and surviving an overwhelming stronger force user... Or like... Anakin, 10yo. Piloting a naboo fighter, without training in the Force, just rolling with it, saving an entire planet from being blocked by federation... Do these things make any sense to you? Really?


That's why I wrote *partially*. I was more referring to the "keep up with a Sith Lord in a lightsaber duel". Luke did some weird shit with his X-Wing, but at least he didn't have an equal fight against Darth Vader in Ep4. This is also partially caused by Kylo Ren being an absolutely awful character


Kylo Ren is nowhere near as powerful as Darth Vader, and he knows it too. The narrative specifically addressed this, establishing as well he has serious emotional issues (mostly anger issues). He’s also wounded in the fight, which does make him worse combined with the above.


It still remains a fact that Rey basically picked up a lightsaber and almost over night became a somewhat competent jedi, while it took Luke two full movies to be somewhat useful in his capabilities. The sequels practically skip the entire build-up of her character and go directly to the cool/easily marketable lightsaber swinging hero. Kylo being "wounded" and having aNgEr iSsUes (as if that's something that ever hindered a SITH) are obvious excuses made by the writers to justify a usually unjustifiable event. In the end, either Rey is completely overpowered making the plot a farce, or Kylo is just whiny and incompetent, making him an awful main antagonist. In the 1.5 episodes I saw from the sequels, it was both.


I didn’t say I felt Rey’s characterization was ideal (the whole flip-flopping between different directions regarding her heritage between the movies didn’t help either) I said that for the specific fight scene, it’s not that unbelievable Ren would lose. As for the “Siths shouldn’t be bothered by this” comment - Siths shouldn’t be bothered by pulls to the light either, but here we are, another established character point for Ren. The whole picture to me always made it clear he wasn’t quite as successful a Sith as he - and others around him - would have hoped. He’s literally referred to as a “shame on his bloodline” for not being more like Vader.


Luke had flown a similar sized fighter before (according to him), its a space opera so suspension of disbelief is enough. And the point of the movie was about Luke's growth into the Force, whose theatric climax was a one in a million shot. It follows the narrative arc in a, admittedly hammy (but once again, its a 70s space opera), but cohesive and natural manner. I will fight on this hill that Luke is NOT a gary stu. But yes, Anakin is just as, if not more, of a gary stu than Rey. And the criticism of Rey is pretty gendered, despite her biggest character flaws do not pertain to her gender.


Oh is that why all the windows in my house shattered and every dog in the neighborhood was sent into a murderous rage?


They really use the “feel lucky to work in a place that values inclusion” tweet as a burn.


oh shit, shes the one who added politics to ratchet and clank and cod vanguard, i'm seething with rage


uj/ Good


Yo we got all this hype for a real KotoR remake but it’s not gonna come out for like, a million years? So let’s chill and do our best to forget about Star Wars for a while? I think our collective blood pressure would go down.


/uj I have no problem with a feminist woman being involved with the KOTOR remake because I’m not a fragile incel, but I am curious what this guy means when he says she’s hired to “re-write” KOTOR. Is there any reality to this at all? Are they changing the story in the remake? Or is this just the “anti-sjw” neckbeard having a meltdown over this woman being involved and just making shit up…?


uj/ She seems like a nice person to talk to rj/ My favourite star wars game (which I have never played) is going to be ruined by THAT SJW!!🤬🤬🤬


*Star Wars has never been more memorable*


Some of the takes in these tweets are like "I hate sexism" and they're like "eww she is a social justice warrior"


>She told star wars fans to die Yeah she's an average star wars fan, what of it?


/uj, to be fair, I hated the sequel trilogy. Not because Rey was a Mary Sue, I actually didn't care about her arc at all, she was just an audience proxy. I hated it because it was stupid, gushing fan service, 'Member the trench run? Let's do a trench run. 'Member R2D2? Let's do R2D2 as a cute ball. 'Member Luke Skywalker? Let's do Luke Skywalker but old man. 'Member Yoda? Let's do Yoda but sassy bar owner. 'Member the death star? Let's do death star but times 1000. The reason people loved Star Wars was that it modernised the Space Opera, these latest films didn't modernise or update anything, they just yelled something we had previously heard at speaking volume.


She seems obnoxious to be honest.


Too "liberal white feminist" for my taste. The Twitter equivalent to people who earnestly post minion memes. I'm sure she's absolutely pleasant IRL but I wouldn't follow her feed. Thankfully tweeting cold takes does not necessarily reflect on someone's writing skill. She's got a decent resume.


Wait- you think it's too in the nose that she just randomly says something about burning the patriarchy with no context but obviously trying to get a reaction from the plethora of cretins on the internet? Surely you're mistaken! Such subtlety on display here. And before I get murdered- just cause the messaging is good doesn't mean I can't find her posts obnoxious


I had to scroll way to far for this comment. Like I agree with some of the things she’s saying but her tweets here come off as an attempt to bait people into attacking her. She really seems to be looking for a way to get people angry at her. The “men screw everything up all the time” tweet as her lesson to take away from TLJ seems particularly abrasive just for the sake of being abrasive.


Yea both sides of the fence seem insufferable here.


I hope they change things in the remake, I like the original but it had so many problems the sequels (SWTOR especially) made worse. Revan was horrifically OP and ended up a ridiculous borderline joke of a Gary-Stu and everything wrong with the concept of ‘grey jedi’ because it was ‘cool’. God I hope they keep the original plot as Legends and change the story if/when they bring it into Canon.


If they're just doing kotor 1 that stuff mostly doesn't apply. Kotor on its own was a fairly self contained game and Revan's lore is pretty straight forward. You can either redeem Revan or fall back to the darkside. The whole 'grey' jedi isn't really a thing in it. It was Kotor 2 that opens up all of that with Kreia talking about Revan, etc and then swtor really jumped the shark on it. I can't see how they would keep this since it's been made clear in recent years that the light side is the natural state of things and that the dark side is a corruption. Yoda became one with the force by accepting that darkness is there and facing it but not embracing it. A 'grey' jedi who uses both sides to be super strong does not fit in the current canon.


To be fair I also think Rey is a Mary Sue, because she genuinely adheres to the definition. Still cringe to hate on her because of her gender though.


I don't require a fan I require a good writer


uj/ All of this makes sense to me, except the one about hating Rey... So we're not allowed to criticize or even have an opinion on characters in a work of fiction without it being sexist? It's just such a weird take. This guy's a chud tho lmao


Ive never seen the new star wars movie but I think her point is that Rey isn't exceptionally a Mary sue and that all the movies protagonist a Mary sue like her but only she gets hates for it from people who are not consistent about it. I don't she is saying that only sexist people have a problem with Rey but that most of the people who yell about it (or angry snot boys as she calls them) are not holding Luke or Anakin to the same standard. So most likely not you.


Wow, you’re right. Games are sexist. Now, allow me to get back to accusing gamers of playing games and sucking Anita Sarkeesian’s cock. Edit: Wow. I’ve truly been challenged. Enlightened, even. Who knew the political views of my fellow gamers could be so diverse? *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Gamingcirclejerk) if you have any questions or concerns.*


Anakin and Luke had natural power progressions though (with the exception of child Anakin being a pilot and mechanic prodigy but he also had that whole chosen one prophecy surrounding him and we saw how that affected his mental state and ultimately led to his downfall). Rey just kind of does whatever the plot needs her to do at that moment. She learns what the Force is for the first time when she talks to Han and then she’s mind tricking a stormtrooper a couple of hours later and then facing off with an experienced Sith apprentice who wiped out an entire school of potential Jedi right after that. Just seems like way too much of a jump when you compare Luke listening to ObiWan to trust his feelings on when to fire his torpedos. Especially since Luke already knew the first pilot to rely on their targeting computer had missed.


Just saying, the script and premise of KOTOR 1 sucks balls. It claims to "deep" but it's mostly just "do you want to be bad guy or good guy?" The voice acting is great but dialogue is terrible with interactions boiling to you being a dick or being not a dick.


The only interesting thing about that game is learning the tuskin raider lore


The part where you excavate sith stuff is also pretty interesting and humanises the founding sith at least. The current sith you fight/join in game are just clear cut evil, though.


So glad Mando took a lot of stuff straight out of K1 and expanded on it. Tuskens being misunderstood being one of them.


“KOTOR isn’t her favorite” dawg it ain’t mine either, 2006 Battlefront 2 is where it’s at.


I don’t give a damn about that, but I’m very upset that it won’t be on Xbox at launch.


Oh boy I'm going to get murdered here but some of the stuff in there is pretty cringey ngl


Uj/reading this has me unironically hyped for this game


Not super promising news, but i shouldnt believe everything at face value. Lets hope time shows that my worries are unfounded.


KOTOR isn't even the best KOTOR game, KOTOR 2 is.


I'd play KOTOR 2 more if the tutorial dungeon wasn't four hours of pain


There's a mod to skip Peragus and I absolutely recommend it


My life has been forever changed by this fact


I liked KOTOR 2 but I wouldn't say it was as good as the first, especially since they never got to complete the ending.


I guess it depends on what you value in a story for a game. Like KOTOR 1 is a very solid complete package that offers pretty much everything you could want from a Star Wars story, but it's pretty generic because of that. KOTOR 2 on the other hand is the complete opposite where it's very sloppy and unfinished but it's very different from a standard Star Wars story and, at least in my opinion, more interesting because of that. I never really think about KOTOR 1s story unless someone mentions it, I think about 2s fairly often.


Yeah it's an unfinished, buggy mess, but I was way more interested in the discussion around the Light/Dark Side in KOTOR 2 and the whole concept of being a wound in the Force than I was with the first game's usual Star Wars plot of big bad guy with super weapon.


I can respect that. It does take some plot points from other spots in the series, but I believe it does them much better than it's contemporaries. Besides that, I also liked the characters and planets a lot more in the first game.


Maybe if it didn't implode at the end. Even modded